There were two problems with the old Location.
20:04:30
A) It wasn't maintained well
20:04:39
B) It never got PROPERLY converted to fapi.
[20:04:54] shady|mapfun: describe a) real quick?
20:05:01
and what is fapi for my benefit?
[20:05:06] Bdragon: Forms API
[20:06:03] shady|mapfun: ok
[20:06:08] Bdragon: OK, so ankur rishi had done lots of 4.6 and 4.7 location work. This kinda tapered off, and the 5.0 release was kinda sucky, as the 4.7 release hadn't been a rewrite from the 4.6 version (4.6 was pre fapi)
20:06:16
4.7 == fapi
20:06:20
5.0 == fapi2
20:06:23
6.0 == fapi3
20:06:53
Location is a bitch to theme properly because it doesn't utilize fapi in a sane manner.
[20:07:06] shady|mapfun: so what is the point of location module?
[20:07:31] Bdragon: The point of location module is to keep track of addresses and sometimes geographical coordinates
[20:07:45] shady|mapfun: how does it work?  what does it do in drupalville?
[20:08:06] Bdragon: How does it work?
20:08:19
Err, "barely?"
20:08:25
Old or new
20:08:34
I know how the fabled "new" version works :P
[20:08:41] shady|mapfun: in general, what functionality does Location provide
[20:09:03] Bdragon: It provides the ability for people to enter postal addresses and/or geographical coordinates
[20:09:20] shady|mapfun: ...associated with a node...?
20:09:24
and/or a taxonomy?
20:09:27
or term?
[20:09:29] Bdragon: It contains stuff like a country / province list, zipcode databases for several countries, and an interface for country specific geocoding
20:09:43
Err, associated with a node or user.
20:10:00
The taxonomy stuff is something I am adding as a side thought under the "new" system
[20:10:01] shady|mapfun: TODO: make a comprehensive list of the "stuff" Location provides
[20:10:20] becw|mapt: also it will geocode addresses entered.
[20:10:28] Bdragon: There are addon modules to add a phone or fax field to the location.
[20:10:34] shady|mapfun: ewwww
[20:10:42] Bdragon: The modules don't work for DISPLAYING such properly under the old version.
20:10:45
So they suck.
[20:10:46] shady|mapfun: those have nothing to do with location
[20:11:16] Bdragon: It's a side effect of location sucking that stuff got pulled in like that
20:11:23
Remember that this was all started pre-cck
20:11:29
Hell, might have been pre flexinode
20:11:37
(anyone remember flexinode? Anyone?)
[20:12:17] shady|mapfun: yes
20:12:22
old school
20:12:25
anyway
[20:12:31] Bdragon: Location is older school than flexinode.
20:12:36
(well the old version is)
[20:12:49] shady|mapfun: what have you done since taking over?  is 2 to 3 a rewrite, a major overhaul, or what?
[20:13:23] Bdragon: Err, it was supposed to be a bugfixing but it turned into a wait for me to finish the big "meta-feature" of fapi-ization and table normalization
20:13:47
It's not a rewrite for 3 any more than necessar
20:13:49
y
20:13:57
However, a lot of the code was touched by the fapi-ization.
20:14:19
[20:14:29] Oh, another thing that people hated: The default theme for the location fieldset involved....
20:14:37
<shock>A TABLE</shock>
[20:14:42] shady|mapfun: ew
[20:15:36] Bdragon: So yeah, THAT is getting axed.
20:15:56
There were several issues in the queue regarding "Get the fucking table out of the default theme impl kthx"
[20:15:58] shady|mapfun: what are 5 improvements or things that are visibly better in Location3 compared to Location2?
[20:16:14] Bdragon: *Easier theming
20:16:19
*Easier extending
20:16:44
*Ability to associate locations with anything
20:16:49
*Full revision support
20:17:20
*Faster
[20:17:34] shady|mapfun: cool
[20:17:36] Bdragon: (partly due to the removal of REAMS of code...)
[20:17:45] shady|mapfun: keep it simple
20:17:46
ok
[20:17:50] Bdragon: The revision support was a bit of a bitch, btw
20:17:53
But I got it done
[20:18:07] shady|mapfun: what do you mean "revision support" and how was it a bitch?
[20:18:28] Bdragon: Err, locations were keyed on vid but this was not honored.
20:18:48
If you reverted a node, locations wounldn't revert to the earlier state, they would DISAPPEAR WITHOUT A TRACE
[20:18:54] shady|mapfun: ha
[20:18:57] Bdragon: Same for VIEWING old revisions
20:19:14
(I mean,they woulnt' disappear completely, they wouldn't show though)
20:19:19
(in the viewing case)
20:19:34
Now, it is done properly
20:20:03
Old revisions will have an older version of a location (it might have the same location id if it hasn't been edited in the meantime)
20:20:14
A location will keep its lid until something about it is edited
20:20:29
There is what amounts to a "diff for locations" built into the new code
[20:20:32] shady|mapfun: wow
20:20:33
cool
20:20:53
ok let's lay some more groundwork
[20:21:09] Bdragon: OK, the top top priority is to get this patch IN and TESTED.
20:21:18
It's nearly all WRITTEN.
[20:21:19] shady|mapfun: let's look at becw's first maptogether alpha that she'll hopefully work on before drupalcon :)
[20:21:24] Bdragon: OOO
20:21:31
I've been hearing about this stuff
[20:21:37] shady|mapfun: about what stuff?
[20:21:40] Bdragon: So maptogether is the "community mapping" stuff, right?
[20:21:52] shady|mapfun: well that's what we're trying to define, FINALLY :)
[20:21:55] Bdragon: Well, hearing becw saying that she's "working on mapt"
20:22:17
Hearing you talking about "all these links I sent ya"
[20:22:30] shady|mapfun: i don't thinkk as much has gone on as you may have inferred :)
[20:22:31] becw|mapt: ah, they're on super
20:22:35
right
[20:22:49] shady|mapfun: but let's look at our first "application" here
20:22:57
and Bdragon, you chime in and tell us where Location fits in
[20:23:05] becw|mapt: there is just beta.maptogether.org which is... drupal with location and gmaps. and nothing else.
[20:23:05] shady|mapfun: So first up, we want to have a database of Places.
20:23:15
A place is a physical location with information about it.
20:23:35
Our hypo use case here will be "searchable community-generated database of homeless shelters"
20:23:49
Bec creates a CCK custom nodetype called Shelter
20:24:05
Title field is Name "PADS Shelter"
20:24:13
we have an address
20:24:15
a phone
20:24:22
and a contact name
20:24:32
and an integer for "Number of beds"
20:24:45
so bec makes a phone field, a "contact name" text field, a "number of bed fields"
20:25:00
does she make an Address field or does she just isntall Location?
20:25:04
Take it from here Bdragon
[20:25:41] Bdragon: ...
20:25:42
OK.
20:26:04
err...
[20:26:37] shady|mapfun: what do we have to do to store address data?
20:26:41
we want to Create a node
[20:26:53] Bdragon: Right
20:26:59
Just weighing stuff
20:27:04
Are we assuming location3 is out?
[20:27:21] shady|mapfun: bec is going to build this Monday
20:28:00
or this weekend if she's bored
[20:28:04] Bdragon: Well, let's assume she's running the patch
[20:28:22] shady|mapfun: quick ? - you're maintainer, so why not just commit this patch?
20:28:23
:)
[20:28:46] Bdragon: Err, because I wanted it to get at least a LITTLE testing by someone else first.
20:28:53
I've been debating just committing it
20:29:41
Could I get becw to critique tonight?
[20:29:52] becw|mapt: yep
[20:29:56] Bdragon: SWEET
20:29:58
OK
[20:30:18] shady|mapfun: ok
20:30:23
so bec is running this patch
[20:30:32] Bdragon: So Location is great at knowing address formats and crap (depending on contributions from people from the country in question)
[20:30:35] shady|mapfun: does Location3 "associate" with Shelter nodetype?
20:30:41
it supplies US address fields?
20:30:46
How will Becw set this up?
[20:30:48] Bdragon: By default
[20:30:54] shady|mapfun: Shit, should we just DO this as we go?
[20:30:58] Bdragon: Location can "attach" to any nodetype
20:31:22
However when it is done like that, you don't get per nodetype control over much more than "how many of these buggers can we put on here?"
[20:31:47] shady|mapfun: "when it is done like that" <-- explain?
[20:32:03] Bdragon: OK, so in theory with the patch you can make a cck field that does a location.
20:32:24
So in theory you could have locations specific to different axes of a node
[20:32:48] shady|mapfun: specific to different axes???
[20:32:50] Bdragon: Like "Pickup points" and "Where the party is at"
20:33:02
Sorry, probabaly wrong term
20:33:22
I mean, if you have different things in a node that need locative information
20:33:38
like "Central office" and "Branch offices", if you have a Company nodetype or something
[20:33:45] shady|mapfun: whoah
20:33:52
i was thinking places were just one discrete point
20:33:59
now this is gonna be all confusing and shit
20:34:08
is any of this documented and sketched out?
20:34:20
or do i have to parse the code?
20:34:22
:)
[20:34:25] Bdragon: OK, then you can do just fine with a "standard" location configured for that nodetype
[20:34:30] shady|mapfun: aha
20:34:32
ok
[20:34:46] Bdragon: When location is installed and active, the content type edit thingie will have a "Locative Information" fieldset
[20:34:49] shady|mapfun: well let's go back into the whole "multiple locations per node" ting later
[20:34:49] becw|mapt: also, 'cck field that does a location' = a cck field type that is an address, gets stored w/ addresses, and gets geocoded by location.module?
[20:34:55] Bdragon: Here, you can turn on locations for that nodetype
20:35:21
becw|mapt: Right, but it acts more like a nodereference or userreference in the backend
[20:35:28] becw|mapt: ah, cool.
[20:35:40] Bdragon: INTERNALLY locations are tracked by their "lid"
[20:35:48] becw|mapt: ahhh
[20:35:56] Bdragon: A specific lid MAY appear in multiple places
[20:36:09] becw|mapt: INteresting.
[20:36:16] shady|mapfun: ok so bec has made nodetype Shelter; added ShelterName, ContactName, Phone, and NumberOfBeds fields... checks the Locative info box and automagically gets Address One, Address Two, City, State, ZIP?
[20:36:22] Bdragon: Think of lid as the inode of the location
20:36:29
(to use unix terminology)
20:36:40
Correct
[20:36:54] shady|mapfun: what if our NPO is in Canada?
20:37:11
where do they define Province and Postal instead of State/ZIP?
[20:37:13] Bdragon: Then just enable canada support in the location settings page
[20:37:16] shady|mapfun: aha
20:37:17
ok
[20:37:34] Bdragon: Well, currently location always says "Province" and "Postal Code"
20:37:48
(because I guess it's the most common terminology on a worldwide basis)
[20:38:07] shady|mapfun: hmm
20:38:15
please file a bug report on that
[20:38:22] Bdragon: It would not be difficult to make it all dynamic and stuff in 6 (Well, changing titles is easy in 5 as well with a little jquery magick)
[20:38:24] shady|mapfun: make it something they have to choose on setup
[20:38:36] Bdragon: We can make it dynamic relatively easily.
[20:38:39] shady|mapfun: quick ? - Location3 is for D5 or D6 or what?
[20:38:45] Bdragon: Both
[20:38:47] becw|mapt: jquery? to change the field name?
[20:38:50] Bdragon: To start with D5 though
20:39:12
becw|mapt: I mean to "localize" the province field to say "State" when you choose USA as your country.
[20:39:28] becw|mapt: yeah, got that.
20:39:50
also, shady|mapfun: were you asking me to file a bug report, or just speaking to Bdragon ?
[20:40:06] shady|mapfun: um
20:40:07
let me think
20:40:09
my goal
20:40:26
we want users to see the correct "division" name
20:40:42
some users are in US and should see State, ZIP
[20:40:45] Bdragon: shady|mapfun: I'm talking PURELY from an input standpoint here
[20:40:54] shady|mapfun: right, me too
20:41:02
i'm taking the "user" role here
20:41:10
so i'm a dude who wants to help bec set up this shelter
[20:41:14] Bdragon: It would be trivial to allow for per country field names...
[20:41:24] shady|mapfun: well hold on
20:41:42
Joe American and Jane Candian are each setting up this homeless application
20:41:47
for their respective cities
20:42:08
Joe wants all his ShelterCreators to just see City/State/ZIP with no country selection
20:42:21
Jane wants her ShelterCreators to see City/Province/Postal
20:42:52
someone in a border town might want their ShelterCreators to select country first and THEN see the correct fields
20:43:02
So this should be something on initial setup that Joe or Jane selects
20:43:25
"Select a country for your Locations, or enabled Pick-A-Country Automagic fields"
[20:44:03] Bdragon: OK.
20:44:54
So normal usecase does not include Comrade Gratofsky from Russia submitting HIS shelter. ;)
[20:45:14] shady|mapfun: right
20:45:38
unless Ivan Ivanovich the Admin has selected Russia cuz the site is in Russia
[20:45:39] Bdragon: OK, so the main sticking point is "It always says Province, why doesn't say State on my site?"
20:45:48
Right
[20:45:49] shady|mapfun: ok so Becw enabled Location2+patch
20:45:52
right
20:45:57
Bdragon: i know that sounds silly maybe
[20:46:05] Bdragon: nah
[20:46:08] shady|mapfun: ok
20:46:14
so Becw enabled Location2+patch
20:46:17
selects US
20:46:20
in the settings
20:46:26
associates location with shelter type
20:48:17
now I'm Jim User
[20:48:17] Bdragon: Would this be Jim Enduser or Jim ShelterOwner?
[20:48:17] shady|mapfun: good distinction
[20:48:18] Bdragon: or ShelterCreator
20:48:18
I meant
[20:48:18] shady|mapfun: we're still in phase 1 here
20:48:19
ok use case clarification
20:48:19
Phase 1: Jim ShelterCreator is a staffperson who manually enters all 100 shelters based on his research
20:48:19
Phase 2: ShelterOwner role is created - they "own" a shelter and their account lets themm login and update information
[20:48:44] Bdragon: OK
[20:49:53] shady|mapfun: ok
20:49:59
so I'm Jim ShelterCreator
20:50:02
I login
20:50:06
go to node/add/shelter
20:50:09
type
20:50:16
Southwest Chicago PADS Shelter
20:50:50
71st and Troy
20:50:54
Chicago, IL ZIP
20:50:57
50 beds
20:51:00
submit
20:51:02
now
20:51:20
on nodecreate, Location grabs the address and submits to $GEOCODER
20:51:23
tell us about this
[20:51:40] Bdragon: OK, so each country has its own .inc file
20:52:18
It defines such things as address formats, the best services to send users off to view maps, and what geocoders support that country
20:52:29
After enabling a country, you can choose which geocoder to use.
20:52:52
On submission, based on the country, it passes the data to the geocoder that was chosen by the admin to be the active one for that country.
20:53:22
The geocoder returns the latitude and longitude, which are stored with the address data as a "location."
[20:53:27] shady|mapfun: TODO: Define things in the country.inc file, exhaustively!!
[20:53:41] Bdragon: Err, there's a guide for writing one
20:53:52
Generally they are submitted by interested people
[20:53:55] shady|mapfun: send it to becw and I?
[20:54:03] Bdragon: Err, it's in the tarball.
[20:54:03] shady|mapfun: i want to know what functionality it provides
[20:54:10] Bdragon: LOCATION_EXTENDING.txt or something
20:54:58
ok.
20:55:06
"It's a country specific include file that specifies
20:55:12
A) The provinces/states of that country
[20:55:47] becw|mapt: extending_support.txt :)
[20:55:50] Bdragon: B) Methods for getting a url to a map
[20:55:54] shady|mapfun: OK, just opened all the .txt files in my copy of Location
20:56:00
which is from like August
[20:56:17] Bdragon: C) A method for getting a "rough idea" of a geocode based on postal data
20:56:30
D) Methods for getting an exact geocode from a web service
20:56:46
E) Links to terms of service for B and D
20:57:11
Things I want to add are
20:57:47
F) Local names for the different parts of a location (i.e. "State" in the US vs "Province" in Canada)
20:58:02
G) Moving most of this shit to a database so we can have automatic updates
20:58:23
H) Enabling the "generic" google geocoder everywhere it makes sense
20:58:55
G and H are post 3.0 tasks. F is needed by your use case.
[20:59:34] shady|mapfun: oh we will probably add more stuff with our use cases :)
[21:00:30] Bdragon: Heh
[21:00:45] shady|mapfun: ok
[21:00:56] Bdragon: I'd like to note that adding a feature to the .inc files requires at last count changing 249 files.
[21:01:05] shady|mapfun: OH MAN
21:01:11
ok
21:01:50
so our geocoding optiosn are Google, Geocoder.us, and our own USTIGER geocoder server.
[21:02:03] Bdragon: For the US?
[21:02:04] shady|mapfun: Bec, as SiteAdmin, is going to pick one in Location Settings?
21:02:09
for this use case, sorry
21:02:16
but options are defined in that .inc file
21:02:22
but since Bec clicks US
[21:02:35] Bdragon: Well, looks like Yahoo is an option in the .us.inc
[21:02:58] shady|mapfun: she sees "use Google Geocoder, (view TOS);; use Geocoder.us, (view TOS);; use private geocoder (enter data)?
21:03:01
right
21:03:10
is the geocoding operation standardized?
21:03:20
or would a private geocoder require its own definition in the inc file?
[21:03:22] Bdragon: Yeah
[21:03:28] shady|mapfun: yeah to what?
21:03:29
:)
[21:03:34] Bdragon: A private geocoder would require definition
21:03:47
Google geocoder can be added to a country with function location_map_link_us_default_providers() {
21:03:47
return array('google');
21:03:48
}
21:04:04
s/us/the country code/
[21:04:17] shady|mapfun: ok
[21:04:28] Bdragon: For the record, here's the other definition for us at the moment
21:04:29
function location_geocode_us_providers() {
21:04:29
return array(
21:04:29
'yahoo' => array('name' => 'Yahoo! Maps Web Services', 'url' => 'http://developer.yahoo.com/maps/rest/V1/geocode.html', 'tos' => 'http://developer.yahoo.com/maps/mapsTerms.html')
21:04:29
);
21:04:29
}
[21:04:58] shady|mapfun: ok well defining a definition for a custom private geocoder is something that only advanced users will do, so we can make them edit text files
[21:05:18] Bdragon: Well, more like "Interested party in Fooistan or Nigeria or wherever"
21:05:29
But yeah
[21:05:39] shady|mapfun: i would like a "ctc.geocoder.module" that installs and allows our predefined geo.chicagotech.org geocoder definition to be used for US stuff, but that can wait for summer
[21:06:11] Bdragon: Sure
21:06:32
For the record, I absolutely *hate* the .inc files
[21:06:43] shady|mapfun: hmm
21:06:52
we gonna change that in L3?
[21:06:56] Bdragon: No
[21:06:56] shady|mapfun: or is that an L4 thing?
[21:07:05] Bdragon: Let's say "3.2" or something
21:07:17
It's not on the roadmap yet.
[21:07:30] shady|mapfun: gotcha
21:07:31
ok
21:07:37
so bec selected US somewhere
21:07:42
(Bec, note where)
21:07:52
bec selected Google geocoder (Bec, note where)
21:08:11
i assume this means we've already requested and activated a GoogleMaps API key for this site
21:08:17
also in Location?  Or is that the Gmap.module?
[21:08:28] Bdragon: Location has a place to enter it.
[21:08:29] shady|mapfun: is the Gmaps API key just for mapping or geocoding as well?
21:08:30
ok
[21:08:42] becw|mapt: select country in admin/settings/location , there is a long list of country checkboxes
[21:08:55] Bdragon: Yeah.
[21:09:01] shady|mapfun: ew gross interface
21:09:05
but we'll deal
[21:09:09] Bdragon: Every one you check will mean loading another inc file. (Did I mention how I hate the .inc files?)
[21:09:13] shady|mapfun: ok i need 2 minutes to refrigerate chinese food and smoke
[21:09:28] becw|mapt: then choose geocoder under admin/settings/location/geocoding
[21:09:31] shady|mapfun: becw|mapt: questions you can ask while i'm gone?
[21:10:20] becw|mapt: (chose geocoder for each country, that is)
21:11:45
then go into the 'configure parameters' link (links to admin/settings/location/geocoding/us/google ) to enter the api key and whatever else a geocoder might require
[21:12:25] Bdragon: Yeah, that all sorta rings a bell, sounds good so far
[21:12:26] becw|mapt: (for each geocoder, info is consistent across countries)
[21:12:50] Bdragon: Well, for "standardized" geocoders you only have to enter the info once
[21:13:00] becw|mapt: right.
21:13:02
then geocoding happens automagically.
[21:13:09] Bdragon: Right
[21:13:14] becw|mapt: when a node w/ location is submitted or saved.
[21:13:21] Bdragon: Yeah
[21:13:42] becw|mapt: hey, a question: when nodes are deleted, are their associated locations deleted?
[21:13:49] Bdragon: Also, if the geocoding is not turned on / fails, it will attempt to get a "rough location" based on postal code.
21:14:00
2.0: No.
21:14:16
3.0: The ability to have them g/c'd automatically is there.
[21:14:39] becw|mapt: g/c?
[21:14:45] Bdragon: garbage collected
21:15:03
"If there are zero references to this lid, delete it..."
21:15:54
I don't have the ability to count references on "unknown" linkages, but I'll probabaly get it implemented sometime...
21:16:11
Location has never actually had the ability to delete locations from the database.
[21:16:42] becw|mapt: ah, yes
[21:16:45] shady|mapfun: becw|mapt: create a new email - team@midwestweb.org, set it to fw to team@chicagotech.org, create a new Gmaps API key for beta.maptogether.org?
[21:17:09] becw|mapt: ah, I created a gmaps api key
[21:17:13] shady|mapfun: sweet
[21:17:14] becw|mapt: is it keyed to my email?
[21:17:18] Bdragon: Err, you know, we SHOULD just get a team@chicagotech.org google account
[21:17:48] shady|mapfun: we have one i think
21:18:01
er, chicagotech@gmail.com is what i was using
[21:18:07] Bdragon: heh
[21:18:11] shady|mapfun: i dunno, since jake left, all that shit's even more disorganized
[21:18:14] Bdragon: You CAN get an "external" account
21:18:27
Heh...
21:18:33
hugs his keepass database
[21:19:53] shady|mapfun: that should be a retreat aim - set up unified, team-wide credential management on Herman or something
[21:20:31] becw|mapt: yeah, that would be useful. though I think I would still keep local copies :)
21:20:46
also <3 keepass, mostly.
[21:21:03] shady|mapfun: well i think we need to set up volume encryption for coop stuff on everyone's machines at the retreat
[21:21:47] Bdragon: hmmm.....
[21:22:02] becw|mapt: ooh ooh did you see the paper on that, like, today?
[21:22:04] Bdragon: http://w3pw.sourceforge.net/ (idea, not necessarily implementation)
[21:22:05] BotdragonSUPY: Title: w3pw - a web based password wallet manager (at w3pw.sourceforge.net)
[21:22:52] shady|mapfun: ok
21:23:18
ok
21:23:25
so node creation SUBMIT
21:23:29
geocoding request happens
21:23:36
geocoder returns Lat and Long?
[21:23:40] Bdragon: Correct
[21:23:50] shady|mapfun: and those are associated - not with the node - but with this whole Location (lid?) concept?!?
21:24:02
this is a primary architecture thing we need to define in the presentation :)
[21:24:06] Bdragon: Right, alongside stuff like "Street" and "Country"
21:24:13
hahaha
21:24:14
http://www.passpack.com/info/home/
[21:24:15] BotdragonSUPY: Title: PassPack Online Password Manager (at www.passpack.com)
[21:24:30] Bdragon: This is like the ONE thing I would not trust a web 2.0 service to...
[21:25:07] shady|mapfun: yeah
21:25:13
i don't share that shit off the laptop
21:25:14
anyway
21:25:26
so how are Nodes associated with Locations then?
21:25:32
because this is confusing for me and users
[21:25:55] Bdragon: Location 2: Something called "eid" and "type"="node" (ala flexinode)
[21:26:02] shady|mapfun: i create a Place - a custom node type that is a Node.  It has an address which corresponds to a Location.  A Location is a discrete address?
[21:26:03] Bdragon: Location 3: "location_instance" table
[21:26:15] shady|mapfun: So if Joe is associated with 123 Main St.
[21:26:17] Bdragon: Yeah
[21:26:25] shady|mapfun: and Jane gets etnered into a database with 123 Main St as HEr address
21:26:32
there are 2 nids that are associated with one LID?
[21:26:40] Bdragon: Not automatically
21:26:59
It is POSSIBLE to do this, the system will NOT currently do it for you though.
21:27:44
I might get around to implementing it sometime when I'm very VERY bored.
21:27:54
But for now, since nobody ever sees lids, "who cares?"
[21:28:14] shady|mapfun: gotcha
21:28:26
ok architecturally, why have a separate Location?
21:28:38
why not just store that info in fields associated with the node?
21:28:48
or is that evidence of my fundamental nonunderstanding of drupal architecture?
21:28:49
:)
[21:29:17] Bdragon: Because searches would have ASS performance in that case.
[21:29:56] becw|mapt: um, what is 'eid'?
[21:30:18] Bdragon: Heh, the short version or the full version?
[21:30:40] becw|mapt: well, I'm just wondering what the db tables look like
21:30:48
since I don't have it installed locally atm
[21:30:48] Bdragon: eid stands for "object id"
[21:31:16] becw|mapt: ah, so it could be a uid, nid, or taxonomy tid or whatevs, right?
[21:31:23] Bdragon: It was originally oid, but when it came time to add postgresql support, ankur found out "oops! pgsql REALLY REALLY DOES NOT LIKE COLUMNS NAMED oid"
[21:31:28] becw|mapt: depending on what 'type'?
[21:31:29] Bdragon: Right
21:31:33
Right
21:31:38
That's the location 2.x way.
21:31:41
Flexinode style.
[21:31:43] becw|mapt: ok cool
21:32:04
(for context, I never worked w/ flexinode)
[21:32:18] Bdragon: Think profile.module
[21:32:20] shady|mapfun: what's the 3.x way?
[21:32:36] Bdragon: lid is the ONLY numeric key in the locations table
21:32:44
There is a join table called "location_instance"
21:33:01
CREATE TABLE {location_instance} (
21:33:01
nid int UNSIGNED DEFAULT NULL,
21:33:01
vid int UNSIGNED DEFAULT NULL,
21:33:01
uid int UNSIGNED DEFAULT NULL,
21:33:02
lid int UNSIGNED NOT NULL DEFAULT '0',
21:33:21
Basically I toss in fk's for all the "core" associations
21:33:43
If nobody uses other associations I can additionally use this to g/c...
21:33:51
[21:34:05] Like so: err..
21:34:21
can't remember the syntax, but it involves a DELETE, a left join, and a IS NULL ;)
[21:34:27] shady|mapfun: well i think we're gong outside the scope of this conversation :)
[21:34:28] becw|mapt: ah, yes. (in 2.x, you wouldn't have a single location as recorded in the db linked to multiple nodes/users/things, because the type and the type id thing/eid is stored directly with the location info.)
[21:34:30] Bdragon: Yeah
21:34:36
Right
21:34:45
Also, this is why there was the revision bug
21:34:53
eid == vid (not nid!) for nodes
21:35:19
And lid is a unique key in locations
21:35:27
(in both 2.x and 3.x)
[21:35:27] becw|mapt: ok, cool.
21:35:39
so shady|mapfun, let's get back inside the scope?
[21:35:48] shady|mapfun: yep
21:36:10
so we've gone through a mechanism to submit a Location-enabled Place
21:36:19
Jim ShelterCreator enters 100 shelters
21:36:24
[21:37:10] Next use cases: A) Show a map of all shelters, with a "CA-style" list of them (paged).  Discuss the performance impact of "too many mapnodes per map" and solutions (that clusterer thing?).
[21:37:47] becw|mapt: CA-style?
[21:38:09] Bdragon: chicagoancestors.org
[21:38:10] shady|mapfun: left side of screen, long list of shelters.  right side of screen: Map of shelters
[21:38:17] becw|mapt: ah.
21:38:53
and aren't the clustering solutions js? ie, they help client-side rendering but don't help backend performance?
[21:38:54] shady|mapfun: b) we have a taxonomy called "type" associated with Shelters.  Four locked optiosn: Men Only, Women Only, Co-Ed, Family.  We want four links: click HERE for Men only shelters.  Click HERE for women only shelters.  Click HERE for coed... etc
[21:39:09] Bdragon: mumble patrick hayes http://drupal.org/project/geobrowser
[21:39:10] BotdragonSUPY: Title: Geobrowser | drupal.org (at drupal.org)
[21:39:21] Bdragon: What we CAN do is render map layers.
[21:39:22] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: no mumbling, please :)  use your sentences
21:39:34
what is geobrowser, how does it relate to this conversation?
[21:39:46] Bdragon: Err, it's a cool thingie...
[21:39:50] becw|mapt: also, shady, see the tabs at the top of http://beta.maptogether.org/map
[21:39:52] BotdragonSUPY: Title: all | Drupal (at beta.maptogether.org)
[21:39:53] Bdragon: Pat Hayes wrote it.
21:39:54
http://www.localfooddirectory.ca/foodshed/geobrowser/
[21:39:55] BotdragonSUPY: Title: Local Food Directory (at www.localfooddirectory.ca)
[21:39:56] shady|mapfun: I understand searching by taxonomy, return Nodes matching that taxonomy
[21:40:04] Bdragon: It's more of a UI thing
[21:40:22] becw|mapt: I did that by building individual views for each term, though there is possibly some more-efficient way?
[21:40:28] shady|mapfun: dammit
[21:40:49] Bdragon: becw: Are you familiar with my work on chicagoancestors.org at all?
21:41:06
i.e. the "roots of mapedelic?"
[21:41:15] becw|mapt: I've looked at chicagoancestors but am not really in-depth familiar with it, no.
[21:41:36] Bdragon: OK, well it's basically a REALLY hacked up location+views+gmap
[21:42:50] shady|mapfun: that localfooddirectory is VERY similar in functionality to what i wanted all our mapping shit to be
21:42:56
oh well i guess we'll cancel all our map plans
21:43:11
maybe we could make one with an interface that doesn't look like it was designed by a psychopath
[21:43:21] eads: I can help with that.
[21:43:23] Bdragon: Heh
[21:43:25] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: are you in contact with this pat hayes person?
[21:43:28] Bdragon: Yeah
[21:43:42] shady|mapfun: will he be at drupalcon?
[21:43:49] Bdragon: Err, good question
21:44:41
I somehow doubt it
[21:45:29] becw|mapt: yeah that's big and fancy (geobrowser that is)
[21:45:33] Bdragon: Heh
21:45:57
geobrowser is all like "The map is the thing. The Drupal is just something inside it."
21:46:10
I always laugh when I see the main drupal as a window inside the map
[21:46:30] shady|mapfun: ok
21:46:43
so tell me how Viewing nodes and mapping fit together with location
21:46:49
talk highlevel and mention specifics
[21:47:30] Bdragon: OK, so location provides some hooks for views to allow filtering by proximity / postal code / whatever
[21:47:46] shady|mapfun: TODO: exhaustively define location's hooks for views
[21:47:47] becw|mapt: brb (2 min)
[21:47:49] Bdragon: Gmap provides a views display plugin to show the results as a map.
[21:48:04] shady|mapfun: with no Gmap, they get returned as a list?
[21:48:24] Bdragon: Or table, or whatever
21:48:39
You know, like a normal view.
[21:49:00] shady|mapfun: gotcha
[21:50:31] Bdragon: In the future, Geo is the one going to be providing the "better faster cheaper" versions of these filters. (Probabaly gonna be a views 2 thing at this rate...)
21:50:40
[21:51:18] OK, full filter list: SQL LIKE: Filter by name / street / additional ("street line 2" basically) / city
21:51:42
Direct selection: Filter by Province / country
21:51:55
Direct entry: Filter by postal code
[21:52:04] becw|mapt: (back)
[21:52:20] Bdragon: Filter by latitude / longitude (special somewhat working mini locpick thingie available)
21:52:34
err, PROXIMITY to said latitude / longitude
21:52:41
This is VERY hacky and shaky under views 1
21:52:58
Filter by distance from postal code
21:53:12
Filter by proximity (direct entry of latitude / longitude)
21:53:28
And a mirror of all this for locations on users.
[21:54:29] shady|mapfun: ew, i think that's not within our use cases
21:54:38
i don't know WHY that's so popular
21:56:11
ok
21:56:15
so what actually happens
21:56:21
i click the "show list+map page"
21:56:28
bootstrap happens, and...
[21:57:24] Bdragon: Err...
21:57:43
I don't know.
21:58:01
I mean, we did it for chicagoancestors.org, phayes did it for localfooddirectory.ca
[21:58:20] shady|mapfun: well
[21:58:21] Bdragon: Lots of people struggle through getting SOMETHING up and running with spit and twine
[21:58:29] becw|mapt: (distracted sidenote: shit a mouse just got caught in a mousetrap like 5 feet from me and it's twitching)
[21:58:31] shady|mapfun: ok
[21:58:42] becw|mapt: (not distracted anymore)
[21:58:53] shady|mapfun: so let's say bec on monday wants to make a "show homeless shelters in chicago" map
[21:58:55] Bdragon: "Turnkey solution" is a big opportunity here.
[21:59:05] shady|mapfun: "turnkey solution" == Mapedelic, man
[21:59:09] Bdragon: Right
[21:59:22] shady|mapfun: so let's spend 5 discussing what has to happen here
21:59:29
and we can announce in the presentation it's what we're working on
21:59:35
and the two of you can get a good start on it next week
[21:59:45] Bdragon: OK, we need mocks. We need magic. We need jquery.
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[22:00:59] shady|mapfun: We don't have a corkscrew!
[22:00:59] Bdragon: I'd LURRRRVE some ui mocks, even if they're paper napkin ones (ESPECIALLY if they're paper napkin ones)
22:01:14
mcgyver.module
[22:01:16] shady|mapfun: All right. Then get me an avocado, an ice pick and my snorkel.Trust me, bro. I've made bongs with less. Hurry up!
[22:01:20] Bdragon: macgyver rather
22:01:22
goddamnit
22:01:41
I have a sudden urge to repo-squat contributions/modules/macgyver
22:02:05
OK, in any case
[22:02:18] shady|mapfun: ok well bec and i will get you some ui mocks then
[22:02:18] Bdragon: How would you imagine a user operating this?
[22:02:26] shady|mapfun: just like CA
[22:02:31] Bdragon: What 10 sites would you say are the easiest to use?
[22:02:31] becw: wait, shady|mapfun, if you're going to talk about that let's go to skype...
[22:02:32] shady|mapfun: ShelterCreator enters place data
[22:02:41] becw: (Bdragon: jk!)
[22:02:41] shady|mapfun: becw|mapt: lol
[22:02:48] Bdragon: (I rather like some of the stuff the phonebook sites do)
[22:03:25] shady|mapfun: well
22:03:28
here are our use cases
22:04:04
# Search (with filter and sort) places and sets based on metadata# Search (with filter and sort) places and sets based on GIS    * proximity (show X within Radius Y)
22:04:13
Show All Shelters of Type == Family
[22:04:27] becw: also, ben sheldon did this site called mapping access ( http://mappingaccess.com/ ) which seems like it could be a basic outcome...
[22:04:31] BotdragonSUPY: Title: The Geography of Community Media | Mapping Access (at mappingaccess.com)
[22:04:31] shady|mapfun: Show All Shelters close to $INPUT_ADDRESS in order of proximity
[22:04:44] becw: ('cept it doesn't have filter & sort stuff)
[22:06:17] Bdragon: Hmm, a) a generic "search results + map".... b) hook a map into the "normal" drupal search system (just numeric markers or something...)
22:06:18
?
[22:07:53] shady|mapfun: thinking
22:08:13
Bdragon: what is the difference between the a) and b) you just mentioned?
[22:08:22] becw: "search results + map" = the regular drupal search, plus the result nodes displayed on a map?
[22:08:34] eads: alright, fuck this, back either later or bright and early
[22:08:38] Bdragon: Not much. One is the "views way" and one is the "Just drupal's search.module way"
eads is now known as eads|saturday.
eads|saturday
eads
[22:08:43] becw: night eads|saturday 
[22:08:51] eads|saturday: thanks everybody, have a good night
[22:09:08] becw: so Bdragon (a) = views?
[22:09:32] Bdragon: Well, I was thinking "Results on left, map on right" or "map above, results below" or "results in cute little box on map" or "no results visible, but clicking or possibly hovering over a marker will show result"
22:09:41
Yeah, a = views
22:10:03
There's already a "map" display plugin. A "list PLUS map" display plugin would be cool...
[22:10:05] becw: right.
22:10:33
wait, 'map' display plugin = the views part of the gmap package, right?
[22:10:40] Bdragon: Right
22:10:58
gmap is focused more towards visualization
[22:11:03] shady|mapfun: gnight eads|saturday
22:12:08
and gmap is focused more on GoogleMap-based visualization, correct?
22:12:10
ok
[22:12:15] Bdragon: Right
22:12:39
Actually, gmap is kinda the "catchall" for the actual "map thingy" whether it be an input element or an output element
[22:12:47] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: can you now - for context purposes - go into what the heck Geo is and how it relates to Gmaps, Location, and other related modules?  Also, any other modules in this sphere that we should know about?
[22:12:53] Bdragon: Openlayers is vastly superior when it comes to input however ;)
22:13:00
OK
[22:13:03] shady|mapfun: ok, map input is NOT in our use cases.
22:13:10
that's another thing i think is flashy but useless
[22:13:12] Bdragon: Heh
[22:13:18] shady|mapfun: what is the use case for map input?
[22:13:31] Bdragon: "We want to define neighborhoods"
22:14:11
(Show all points within "neighborhood" polygon is something that is easy and fast with geospatial operators.)
[22:14:24] shady|mapfun: hmm
22:14:35
so they click the map to identify the neighborhood that contains their click point
[22:14:40] Bdragon: OK, so geo.module is a "geospatial data wrangler"
[22:14:47] shady|mapfun: OT - just heard "he demolitioned this room" on the news
[22:14:51] Bdragon: Right, and you could have it show everything in that neighborhood
[22:14:58] shady|mapfun: that's worse than people who use "administrate" or "conversate" as a verb
[22:15:03] Bdragon: Argh
[22:15:07] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: well hmm
22:15:19
Bdragon: that's a search interface, but not a Place Creation interface then
[22:15:52] Bdragon: No, I'm saying that you can easily and intuitively edit the neighborhood polygons with openlayers
22:16:21
Gmap has a really sucky polygon maker but really sucks at editing. It's a big hack.
22:16:44
Just trust me, openlayers kicks gmap's ass when it comes to adding / editing actual spatial data
22:16:56
It's not an issue when everything's coming in from the geocoder
[22:17:06] shady|mapfun: ok
22:17:27
so please go into detail on how geo.module wrangles geospatial data
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[22:17:35] shady|mapfun: TODO: list every function of geo.module
[22:17:41] Bdragon: hahaha
22:17:42
no.
[22:17:43] shady|mapfun: TODO: list every function of gmap.module
22:17:54
TODO: list every function of openlayers.module
[22:17:57] Bdragon: Oh, you don't mean function() do you?
[22:17:59] shady|mapfun: i don't mean every function()
[22:17:59] Bdragon: heh
[22:18:00] shady|mapfun: LOL
[22:18:00] Bdragon: OK
[22:18:04] shady|mapfun: i mean every "feature"
[22:18:08] Bdragon: OK, geo.module:
[22:18:11] shady|mapfun: or "piece of functionality"
[22:18:47] becw: (also, there are some kml datasets for things like population by block group, which can be loaded into google earth and gmaps, but they need to be vastly simplified (math!) before they can be used with gmaps... so many points on these suckers that they are paged out to like two polygons at a time)
[22:18:58] Bdragon: Store geospatial data (i.e. latitude/longitude, lines, polys) in a database specific and REALLY FUCKING FAST way. Allow querying and doing complex computations on it in a REALLY FUCKING FAST way.
22:19:22
geo.module will never give a rats ass about "address" or "zip code."
22:19:36
It's a geometry cruncher
22:19:59
It's VERY useful if you have a really LARGE dataset
[22:20:07] shady|mapfun: replaced by PostGIS features in PGSQL?
[22:20:14] Bdragon: Right
22:20:29
And a combination of Mysql Spatial + emulated stuff in mysql
[22:20:38] shady|mapfun: so Geo gives us Lat/Lon-derived GIS-specific calculations when using MySQL that PostGIS would give us natively?
[22:20:43] Bdragon: And a future possibility of Oracle spatial far down the road
22:20:56
Geo's first language was postgis
22:21:02
I'm the one that added mysql support :P
22:21:23
Right
[22:21:50] shady|mapfun: ok, so functionality descriptions of Gmap.module and OpenLayers modules?
22:21:56
(brb 1/2 a smoke)
[22:22:06] Bdragon: If you ask PostGIS "give me all the locations that occured within this complex polygon" it goes "Ha! I laugh at your puny request! Here ya go!"
22:22:23
[22:22:28] gmap.module: "We wanna map shit."
22:22:45
"Let's figure out how to display everything."
22:23:00
"Hmm, location.module has a nice latitude / longitude field..."
22:23:07
"Hmm, geo can give us a nice set of points"
22:23:29
"Hmm, we can make views call us up if we define a display plugin"
22:23:56
"Hmm, users like to look at users on a map and nodes on a map. Let's provide some default pages to show that."
22:24:23
"Hmm, users want to put maps in their blog posts. Let's make a macro language to allow putting [gmap] tags in posts."
[22:24:40] becw: hahah
[22:24:46] Bdragon: "Hmm, users want to be able to make cool [gmap] tags. Let's make an interface for making them"
22:25:06
[22:25:28] location.module: "I know how you would address an envelope to EVERY country! MUAHAHAHA"
[22:25:33] becw: shady|mapfun: I vote we use this language in the drupalcon session.
[22:25:58] Bdragon: "I know how to geocode a lot of places. There's a lot of places I don't know how to geocode as well, though."
22:26:07
"I store addresses.
22:26:21
"I format addresses."
22:26:29
"I'm the one who people see on the edit form."
22:26:58
"My search algorithms suck, but work on mysql3 ffs."
22:27:19
"If you need a local map of an address, I can get you a link."
22:27:40
"I have a pretty good list of countries and provinces"
22:28:18
"I have some nice zipcode to coordinate lookup tables that are useful sometimes, but nobody ever seems to actually bother loading in because it's a pain in the ass"
22:28:51
Openlayers:
[22:29:35] becw: Bdragon: this is good :)
[22:30:08] Bdragon: "I can make a map out of some nasa layers, some yahoo layers, some WFS layers from some kid's basement server, and add a nice interface to doodle on the map over WFS-T"
22:30:23
"I can speak EVERY mapping protocol."
22:30:36
"I'm like a little desktop GIS application in your webbrowser"
22:30:57
"I'm the CARTOGRAPHER's choice!"
[22:31:06] shady|mapfun: wow
22:31:07
ok
[22:31:10] Bdragon: "I'm pretty user friendly, but my default theme is butt ugly"
22:31:29
"Which is probabaly why people always use gmap for the user facing parts :P"
[22:31:31] shady|mapfun: eads|saturday can help there too
[22:32:01] Bdragon: Seriously, openlayers is a frigging desktop GIS platform rolled into a tight little javascript package
[22:32:08] shady|mapfun: got a demo?
22:32:24
describe openlayers the module and how that relates to "openlayers the technology"
22:32:34
"spaceballs II: the search for more money"
[22:32:34] Bdragon: Openlayers the module does not exist yet.
[22:32:37] shady|mapfun: aha
[22:32:42] Bdragon: Well
[22:32:47] shady|mapfun: i have been touting you as the maintainer of that module
22:32:49
:)
[22:33:01] Bdragon: I mean, I have a tech demo of passing WKT data back and forth
22:33:09
and it runs
22:33:16
but it's not hooked into anything useful at the moment
22:33:27
Heh
22:33:39
hook_elements #type = 'editable-map'
22:34:33
Anywho
22:34:46
Openlayers is mostly outside the scope of maptogether at the moment
[22:35:01] shady|mapfun: ok
[22:35:13] Bdragon: http://openlayers.org/dev/examples/editingtoolbar.html or http://openlayers.org/dev/examples/draw-feature.html are good examples of using openlayers as an editor
[22:35:14] BotdragonSUPY: Title: OpenLayers Editing Toolbar Example (at openlayers.org)
[22:35:17] shady|mapfun: how do we do mapping using Free data and Free tools apart from Gmap?
[22:35:24] Bdragon: ooo
22:35:24
wfs
22:35:27
err
22:35:31
http://openlayers.org/dev/examples/wfs-scribble.html
[22:35:32] BotdragonSUPY: Title: Scribble on a WFS (at openlayers.org)
[22:35:38] Bdragon: Openlayers.
22:35:56
Openlayers is the flagship open source map display thingie
22:37:07
bleh, the wfs-t server is down
22:37:27
(so the scribble link won't work. It's hella cool though, whenever you change stuff it saves it back to the server)
[22:38:27] shady|mapfun: ok
[22:38:39] Bdragon: (the toplevel examples page http://openlayers.org/dev/doc/examples.html)
[22:38:40] BotdragonSUPY: Title: OL Docs (at openlayers.org)
[22:38:43] Bdragon: Anyway
22:38:47
Let's see...
[22:38:56] shady|mapfun: so we have TWO BIG things i see on the roadmap
22:39:47
"the turnkey solution" <-- lets users integrate Location, Geo, Gmap, and do simple "add Place", "view Place", and "view Place Views (search results, tag filters, etc)
22:40:05
2nd is completing a Gmap alternative using all FLOSS and free-data tools
[22:40:10] Bdragon: Well, turnkey will probabaly start off being just location and gmap
[22:40:24] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: talk to me about 'turnkey solution' which I think is what would be meant by "Mapedelic"
[22:40:33] Bdragon: Sorry
[22:40:36] shady|mapfun: ?
22:40:40
ah
22:40:42
:)
[22:40:44] Bdragon: I meant, let's start with location
22:41:11
location currently encompasses a (sucky version of) a superset of the "bullet point features" of geo.
[22:42:01] shady|mapfun: you think the Future is Geo?
[22:42:09] Bdragon: Yeah
[22:42:14] shady|mapfun: sigh
[22:42:15] Bdragon: but the Present is Location
22:42:22
And the Migration is Easy
[22:42:31] shady|mapfun: so why bother making Location3?
22:42:36
why not throw all your efforts into Geo?
[22:42:46] Bdragon: Because location2 sucks and SOMEONE has to store the addresses
22:42:55
geo does not store addresses. Geo stores geodata.
22:43:28
I have to get an official frigging release of gmap out as well.
22:44:29
[22:45:11] The optimal solution is: "Gut location and remove everything but the address handling."
[22:45:35] shady|mapfun: well
[22:45:37] Bdragon: i.e. "Don't let location store lat/lon anymore, geo kicks its ass at that."
[22:45:42] shady|mapfun: that's not optimal for us owning the GISdrupal space
[22:46:46] Bdragon: Everybody hates location's handling of lat/lon anyway.
22:47:26
And when I say "remove everything but the address handling" I'm talking code
[22:47:28] becw: well if geo's doing the spatial operations anyway, shady|mapfun 
[22:47:41] Bdragon: Most of location is "really half assed attempts at spatial operators"
22:47:57
The actual stuff it's GOOD at is the address handling
22:48:04
Well, by size
22:48:13
2% is "address handling shiz that works"
22:48:24
5% is "sucky spatial operators that suck."
[22:48:31] becw: so unless we wanted to duplicate something that's done well elsewhere, it might make sense to put the lat/long elsewhere
[22:48:50] Bdragon: (therest)% is "hugeass zipcode database dumps / country .inc files)
[22:49:01] becw: (but in that case, 'location' might not be the most accurate name for location.module)
[22:49:12] Bdragon: More like Place.module
[22:49:18] shady|mapfun: ok so we can't do "MapTogether" without Geo
22:49:47
or, we could do super simple MapTogether if we handled basic lat/long storing, but any GIS stuff would be duplicating geo so we might as well just work toward Geo?
[22:49:58] Bdragon: B
22:50:35
We can fix up what location has as an interim solution. We can focus on making geo shine. Then we can write migration code and make the next version of location declare a dependency on geo ;)
[22:50:43] becw: fyi, I'm gonna need to head out in about 30 mins.
22:51:13
that sounds like a pretty good path, Bdragon/shady|mapfun 
[22:51:53] shady|mapfun: becw: sure thing
[22:51:59] Bdragon: Location lat/lon -> geo is a relatively easy and non-lossy migration path.
[22:52:06] shady|mapfun: ok so Bdragon, what is the status of geo module?
22:52:17
you and Mark are comaintainers?
[22:52:25] Bdragon: Yeah
[22:52:31] shady|mapfun: how does that work day to day?
22:52:34
is he active?
[22:52:35] Bdragon: It works. It's just nothing useful knows about its existence
22:52:45
Well, we're both somewhat inactive at the moment
[22:53:30] becw: well, it's logical that 'nothing useful knows...' because there's not even a dev release about yet.
[22:53:31] Bdragon: But I have full say on committing stuff as long as I don't do something silly like remove postgis support ;)
22:53:47
It's a bit of a chicken/egg though
[22:53:59] becw: perhaps.
[22:54:42] Bdragon: I need to make location call geo apis, and gmap call geo apis.
22:54:48
Location can call gmap apis already
[22:54:54] shady|mapfun: is mark going to drupalcon?
[22:54:58] Bdragon: gmap can use location data already
22:55:09
Err, dunno. It would be cool if he was
[22:55:14] shady|mapfun: the fact that they use fucking Garland on their theme does not give me a ton of confidence about Advantage Labs
22:55:22
well if he's going, he should be a co-presenter
[22:55:29] Bdragon: Hahaha, have you seen MY portfolio site?
[22:55:42] shady|mapfun: well this is a company that has tried to sell us and others on their drupal services
[22:55:50] Bdragon: 
http://bdragon.rtk0.net/
[22:55:51] BotdragonSUPY: Title: Welcome | Brandon Bergren (at bdragon.rtk0.net)
[22:55:54] Bdragon: Fuckin bluemarine, man.
[22:56:04] becw: but geo apis can *exist* without other things relying on it yet. (as it stands, I/people can't even d/l a release to tinker with without checking it out of cvs, which I will do soon anyway)
[22:56:17] Bdragon: Heh
[22:56:21] shady|mapfun: so describe his contributions - like totally dormant?  At a point where, if you're getting PAID as part of your day job to expand geo, it makes sense for you to be controlling maintainer?
[22:56:23] Bdragon: Yeah, same for location3 :P
22:56:27
Nah
22:56:31
He's just busy at the moment
22:56:59
He's available over email and stuff
[22:57:01] shady|mapfun: ok
22:57:06
is he on irc right now?
22:57:09
by chance?
22:57:11
i got his email
22:57:15
and his bosses'
[22:57:20] Bdragon: Nope
22:57:40
In any case, he's cool with anything I do to geo
22:58:30
Holy shit, it's nearly 10pm
22:59:54
oh, becw, I have a patch for ya..
23:00:08
err, rebecca@chicagotech.org?
[23:00:15] becw: yeah, thanks!
[23:00:17] shady|mapfun: just invited him to copresent, cc'ed you both
23:00:20
ok
23:00:24
it's been 3 hours
[23:00:26] Bdragon: Cool
[23:00:28] shady|mapfun: i think this has been a great meeting
23:00:29
goals
23:00:53
I think becw should take the lead on documenting what we talked about, overall GIS on Drupal architecture, etc.
23:01:05
becw and I will collaborate on turning this into a suitable 30 minute presentation
23:01:14
(leaving 10 minutes for overhead and 20 minutes for Q&A)
[23:01:20] Bdragon: Yeah, my "architecting" attempts generally turn out to be a trainwreck.
[23:01:45] shady|mapfun: key to this is that Bdragon will be super ultra availalble and really as helpful as possible to Bec because she will hopefully have tons of questions and "Hey bdragon verify this"
23:01:52
becw: questions, concerns, objections to this plan?
[23:02:28] becw: what's my timeframe on this? approximate due date, hours to spend on it?
23:02:48
I know the drupalcon session email said by feb 25...
[23:02:53] shady|mapfun: oh yeah
23:02:56
i need to get on that
[23:03:08] Bdragon: And I love answering questions
[23:03:11] shady|mapfun: becw: well you're pretty much done with voca, erf, and amc right?
23:03:30
you're auth'ed on this fulltime (plus as much extra as we can get you) between now and drupalcon
[23:03:39] becw: but I would say end of day monday would be draft time
[23:03:44] Bdragon: Preeow
23:04:11
114 kb patch to location and 4kb patch to gmap XD
[23:04:20] becw: or, end of day monday = time I start passing things around and asking questions, depending what I do this weekend.
23:04:29
ok, shady|mapfun 
[23:04:39] shady|mapfun: becw: you're ok with this plan in general?
[23:04:49] Bdragon: becw: Patch sent, enjoi!
[23:04:59] shady|mapfun: i think we'll have more than enough content just based on this discussion to cover a 30-50 minute long presentation
[23:05:04] becw: yeah, I think so.
23:05:12
and, yes on the presentation.
[23:05:19] shady|mapfun: we get the presentation in progress and immediately start on some prototyping and examples to demo in the presentation
[23:05:21] becw: thx Bdragon!
[23:05:58] Bdragon: OK, I'm gonna put together my Timesheet
23:07:14
Any feedback or additions to the patch are welcome
[23:07:15] shady|mapfun: alright thanks to you both
23:07:22
[23:07:33] next week will be: Bdragon works on Loc3, geo, and gmap.  Answers Bec's questions
23:07:45
Bec works on the presentation (with me) and the prototype site (with me)
23:08:08
then when we all meet, we squeeze all avail time at dcon on monday and tuesday to discuss, tweak, polish, and rehearse
23:08:17
prsentation is weds the 5th at 3:30 pm i beleive
[23:08:57] Bdragon: shady|mapfun: Where's my ohare ticket? :P
[23:09:15] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: so you're sure you want to ride with a bunch of us for 20 hours?
23:10:04
:)
[23:10:05] Bdragon: Well, that depends on the power inverter situation
[23:10:05] shady|mapfun: Bdragon: not sure if you saw any of the dozens of emails and IRC threads about this but we are having some major cash flow situation
[23:10:06] Bdragon: Wait, you aren't gonna drive to south dakota to pick me up are you?
23:10:34
Err, what side of the country is massachusetts in again? East?
[23:10:41] becw: hahahaha
[23:10:44] shady|mapfun: yes, east
23:10:46
map expert
23:10:51
it's very east
23:10:53
on the edge
23:10:58
right next to the big blue polygon
[23:11:00] Bdragon: Oh, right, it was one of the colonies
23:11:03
HAHAHAHA
23:11:09
(literally)
[23:11:22] shady|mapfun: if our cash flow problems dry up this week (very unlikely apparently) we will get one of these:   http://www.airlink101.com/products/ar360w3g.html
[23:11:23] BotdragonSUPY: Title: Routers AR360W3G (at www.airlink101.com)
[23:11:28] shady|mapfun: and a cingular data card
23:11:36
cellular internet routed via wifi to everyone in the van
23:11:47
and a heavy duty inverter that can handle the router and at least 3 laptops at a time
[23:11:48] Bdragon: Heh
23:11:51
There ya go
23:12:04
Heh, talk about "mobile office"
[23:12:23] shady|mapfun: ok
23:12:27
so we have a plan
[23:12:48] Bdragon: OK, what about me though? Are you gonna be able to scrape together enough to get me TO the van?
[23:12:51] becw: heh that's pretty cool
[23:12:54] Bdragon: Am I gonna have to drive somewhere?
23:13:24
(I don't think I have access to a distance-capable vehicle...)
23:14:27
I'm fine with the roadtrip and all, I'm just worried about how to get to the van :P
23:14:31
What's the plan there?
[23:15:40] becw: ok, I think I'm outta here. Bdragon, you'll hear from me about those patches. shady|mapfun, I'll get started with shaping up this convo monday, most likely.
[23:15:49] Bdragon: Sweet.
[23:16:04] becw: laters!
[23:16:12] shady|mapfun: thanks becw!